Curse

Scarlett W · Jul 11, 2008, 09:15 AM // 09:15

So, I finally got this game this past Monday, bought the pvp access pack and tried out playing monk in Random Arenas and elementalist in Alliance Battles.

During my testing period in Random Arenas, I tried to follow advice given to me by the person who talked me into getting this game, but before the very first match, this one guy started verbally assaulting me for having a sword and shield equipped and told me only noob monks used a sword. I tried to tell him that it wasn't my casting set, but he called me a noob and quit. We managed to win that fight mostly because our Dervish was a killing machine, but after ten wins, we were massacred in under 20 seconds, I don't know if they just paired two 10 win teams or what.

My first question is: am I really a noob for having a sword and shield set? I really liked that set because every time some mesmer tried to steal my energy, I never had more than 25, and almost always I was only at 4-10. Also, I always took less damage than when they attacked me on my wand and focus set.

Second, I was also vilified for not having a resurrection skill, but again, the person who talked me into getting this game said monks shouldn't carry resurrection skills.

Third, should I keep playing random arenas and alliance battles, or should I try to get into more competitive forms of pvp? My map says I have random arenas, team arenas, and hero battles, but I keep seeing "XXXX team's has won a battle in the hall of heroes" and would like to know what that is all about.

By the way, here is the build I was using in RA: hope it's not horrible, but the access pack only gave me 20 normal skills to unlock, and 20 elites
1 reversal of fortune
2 zealous benediction
3 guardian
4 shielding hands
5 spirit bond
6 dismiss condition
7 revealed hex
8 Power Drain
Had Protection at 12, Divine Favor at 9, and Inspiration Magic at 9. I was tempted to unlock healing skills, but I looked at warrior and dervish skills and didn't think the healing skills could possibly keep up with the damage potential of those skills.

Don't even know if this is the right section to post this, but like I said, complete newb trying to get advice from people who already know something about the game.

Oh, and if someone could help me out a little in game, my ign is "Scarlett fries U"

Sorry, I'm a little long-winded.

RhanoctJocosa · Jul 11, 2008, 09:23 AM // 09:23

Wow, you sound like a VERY promising player.

- sword + shield set is absolutely necessary: try sit in it as much as you can, swapping to wand/focus when you want to cast spells.
- no you don't need a res if you're a monk
- that build is fine
- the XXXX has won a battle thing is called Heroes Ascent... you unlock it once you win 5 matches in a row in RA or TA (I think? never had to do it). To win in the Hall of Heroes is pretty difficult, especially if you're a new player.

I'm free now if you want some help or anything... just throw me a pm

gl

DarkNecrid · Jul 11, 2008, 09:27 AM // 09:27

Quote:

My first question is: am I really a noob for having a sword and shield set? I really liked that set because every time some mesmer tried to steal my energy, I never had more than 25, and almost always I was only at 4-10. Also, I always took less damage than when they attacked me on my wand and focus set.

RA has a lot of bad players. As a caster class you want a sword & shield set. To not have one is bad. It's good for hiding your energy and switching to a high set.

Quote:

Second, I was also vilified for not having a resurrection skill, but again, the person who talked me into getting this game said monks shouldn't carry resurrection skills.

Any time you're spending rezzing is time you're not spending doing your job. The guy who attacked you for this was baed.

Quote:

Third, should I keep playing random arenas and alliance battles, or should I try to get into more competitive forms of pvp? My map says I have random arenas, team arenas, and hero battles, but I keep seeing "XXXX team's has won a battle in the hall of heroes" and would like to know what that is all about.

RA is good for getting mechanics. It's a good place to master weapon swapping til it becomes a second thought, a good place to practice when you change your UI (btw make your compass and activation bars (both you and your enemy) bigger)) and controls, and a good place to just learn skill interactions. AB is a good place to learn capping and splitting if nothing else.

HA is a place full of gimmicks because it is built poorly.

GvG is the high end that ultimately matters the most and gets the most tournament support, but you need to find a good guild for it.

Your build: I'd switch out Shielding Hands for [Gift of Health], and Revealed Hex for [Shield of Absorption]. I'd remove Power Drain for [Holy Veil].

This will give you a build that is a bit tighter on energy, but will help you learn to focus on the battlefield instead of having leeway to spam things a bit. You'll make every spell count and make less mistakes over time this way.

Hope this helps.

EDIT:
Also at 10 wins in RA you face a TA (Team Arena) team.

Icy The Mage · Jul 11, 2008, 09:31 AM // 09:31

You...just...started... and you're already energy hiding, focus swapping, know all the basics of PvP, and you got a 10 win streak on your first try?

Damnit, I wish I was as pro as you when I started PvPing...

Everything you did was right btw, except maybe you'd want to swap that sword out for a spear, which helps a little bit more when you're targeting an enemy and hit space, (so you don't mess up your kiting) or helping interrupt dazed targets from a distance).

Good luck, and have fun!

Scarlett W · Jul 11, 2008, 09:40 AM // 09:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcyFiftyFive

You...just...started... and you're already energy hiding, focus swapping, know all the basics of PvP, and you got a 10 win streak on your first try?

Damnit, I wish I was as pro as you when I started PvPing...

Everything you did was right btw, except maybe you'd want to swap that sword out for a spear, which helps a little bit more when you're targeting an enemy and hit space, (so you don't mess up your kiting) or helping interrupt dazed targets from a distance).

Good luck, and have fun!

Thanks for the quick replies guys. As I said, I got extremely lucky with my team, as the Dervish guy was a killing machine. Noticed that those who were brave and just stood there died really quickly, I am more of a coward and just ran from the warriors and assassins chasing me. Guess being a live coward is better than a dead brave person.

I guess I'll unlock gift of health and holy veil and give those a try. Already have shield of absorption, but that seemed a little redundant with shielding hands. Only chose shielding hands based on the casting time, though I wish I had shield of absorption during those times when my guardian got interrupted and I had two warriors stuck to my butt.

I hadn't even considered a spear, but I guess I'll give that a shot too.

Monk Gsb · Jul 11, 2008, 09:40 AM // 09:40

i have faith in the "newbies" if this is your worries xD

most "newbies" are still looking to find RA.

you should go Monk/Assasin Monk/Warrior or Monk/Elementalist (depending on how your doing and whats in ra.)

if there is alot of KD's in ra go Monk/Warrior and take ballenced stance and either sprint or disiplined stance.
if there is alot of melle DPS (dervs, warriors R/D R/W ect ect) go Monk/Assasin with dash or dark escape and return.
if your having troubbles keeping ur energy up enough to heal go Monk/Elementalist and take Glyph of lesser energy, and take mending touch.

Krill · Jul 11, 2008, 09:59 AM // 09:59

RA is full of scum, don't ever listen to what people say there unless it's a good player giving you a friendly tip. A lot of people here will say don't play RA at all but I think you can learn things in monking in RA solo, surviving ganks that are specifically brought to insta-gay monks and idiot teammates.

Breakfast Mc Rit · Jul 11, 2008, 10:41 AM // 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarlett W

Noticed that those who were brave and just stood there died really quickly, I am more of a coward and just ran from the warriors and assassins chasing me. Guess being a live coward is better than a dead brave person.

You've got the right idea again; you don't want to sit there and let them pummel you. I'm sure most of the people you played with thought you had been playing this role for a long time.

White Lies · Jul 11, 2008, 11:38 AM // 11:38

Evrything uve mentioned is perfect. evrything the guy that was anoying u said is wrong.

the only other thing i can say is uve got alot of promise as a PvPer, and hell i wish i had ur instinct 4 pvp cuz it wud make my pvp life eisier

-Lies

Divinus Stella · Jul 11, 2008, 12:51 PM // 12:51

Well to sum up the PvP arenas:

HB/AB: A bit like a school for disabled children, nothing worth playing.

RA: mainly PvE players, no real depth to the play there just a place to try bars out and often where most players start to get into PvP.

TA: Same as RA but you get to pick your team, the arena doesnt offer much in the way of expansion and is currently dead due to a stale meta.

HA: Always been full of gimmic builds, it was a good place to get into PvP a year ago but now the whole arena is pretty much dead, not a place you want to play if you intend to improve as a player.

GvG: The only PvP arena thats actually supported by the people who run the game, this is the basis of skill changes since the level of play is the highest of all arenas and its also one of the easiest forms of PvP to get into since theres a ladder with guilds plating at all skill levels (if you play during european times).

My advice if you really want to get into PvP would be to join a GvG guild and build experience with the arena, it doesnt matter what rank they play aslong as you find people that use ventrilo and play often.

Theres always lots of people recruiting but most will have requirements like rank of some kind of how much balthazar faction you've earned, if you find an active GvG guild with an alliance you should be able to build up a good friends list, i think the key to getting into GvG is guesting for everyone you can, that way people will notice if you're good.

moriz · Jul 11, 2008, 02:19 PM // 14:19

i wish i was that good when i just started. i lost every match for 2 weeks until i finally got the hang of things.

pm me if you need help with anything.

ign lilith moriz

Eddie Frenzy Spam · Jul 11, 2008, 02:24 PM // 14:24

2 words: You're pro

=P

Seriously, for a person who has only recently got the game, but has learnt about shield/sword sets, kiting, prot>heal, all that good stuff, is amazing really.

By the sounds of it you really do have potential to be a good player, unfortunately you have started the game a bit late, and alot of people seem to be quiting =( GvG though is still a relatively active area of PvP, hell recently we've even seen the return of Esoteric Warriors [ EW ] which I was pretty shocked to see =P

Captain Robo · Jul 11, 2008, 03:57 PM // 15:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarlett W

So, I finally got this game this past Monday, bought the pvp access pack and tried out playing monk in Random Arenas and elementalist in Alliance Battles.

Welcome to the game. It's a shame you weren't here for the glory days (and everyone is lauding you for a reason, you displayed some really advanced tactics beyond what most of the player base is capable of even after 3 years). Old GW PvP was worlds ahead of any other game, and I'm really disappointed that it has turned into such shit.

Quote:

During my testing period in Random Arenas, I tried to follow advice given to me by the person who talked me into getting this game, but before the very first match, this one guy started verbally assaulting me for having a sword and shield equipped and told me only noob monks used a sword. I tried to tell him that it wasn't my casting set, but he called me a noob and quit. We managed to win that fight mostly because our Dervish was a killing machine, but after ten wins, we were massacred in under 20 seconds, I don't know if they just paired two 10 win teams or what.

After a 10 win streak, you get bumped to TA from RA. TA teams own RA a teams, generally, because they're using cookie cutter builds/are better players/have ventrilo.

The person who told you that about swords/shields was stupid. Caster swords/shields (+5e and 20% enchant duration / +30 health) are arguably the best weapons to have, and shields give casters some much needed armor, health, and condition relief. If you stick with monking, you'll realize the importance of a low energy set, because energy drain effects cannot reduce your energy below 0 (so once you come under fire and drop really low, swap into your high set, cast a spell, then swap back to low before your opponent's cooldowns are up again).

Quote:

My first question is: am I really a noob for having a sword and shield set? I really liked that set because every time some mesmer tried to steal my energy, I never had more than 25, and almost always I was only at 4-10. Also, I always took less damage than when they attacked me on my wand and focus set.

You are hope for the game, this brings tears to my eyes.

Quote:

Second, I was also vilified for not having a resurrection skill, but again, the person who talked me into getting this game said monks shouldn't carry resurrection skills.

Your buddy is 100% right. Monks can get away with not bringing resurrection, because if they do their job, nobody should die. Furthermore, the extra skill they bring really is more important than having a resurrection skill. The only class that can really 'hard' resurrect (that's a reusable resurrection skill) is the mesmer, as their fastcast bonus makes resurrection worthwhile. Everyone else should be bringing a rez sig, at the very least.

Quote:

Third, should I keep playing random arenas and alliance battles, or should I try to get into more competitive forms of pvp?

Absolutely, this has always been the best part of the game. Try and GvG a bit and see how you like it, but I assure you it's not anywhere near what it used to be.

Quote:

By the way, here is the build I was using in RA: hope it's not horrible, but the access pack only gave me 20 normal skills to unlock, and 20 elites
1 reversal of fortune
2 zealous benediction
3 guardian
4 shielding hands
5 spirit bond
6 dismiss condition
7 revealed hex
8 Power Drain
Had Protection at 12, Divine Favor at 9, and Inspiration Magic at 9. I was tempted to unlock healing skills, but I looked at warrior and dervish skills and didn't think the healing skills could possibly keep up with the damage potential of those skills.

You're something of a prodigy, you know that? For a first attempt at a monk bar, you've created a knockoff of one of the most efficient templates. It's a perfectly fine bar, but as you get more into the game, you'll be comfortable with less energy as a monk, and you'll find that ZB on its own is energy management enough. But you're already running before you've walked, as it is...

PvX wiki, though despised by many players here, is a good source of starter templates, especially the more common ones to get you familiar with what everyone else is going to be playing against you. Knowing how to play against something is just as important as playing competently on your own.

Hey, you've given me some new purpose to play this game again. I'll gladly team up with you if you want to do arenas or something.

DarkNecrid · Jul 11, 2008, 04:03 PM // 16:03

Yea same here I already offered him that too.

I don't care what but thats cool.

also

Quote:

The only class that can really 'hard' resurrect (that's a reusable resurrection skill) is the mesmer, as their fastcast bonus makes resurrection worthwhile. Everyone else should be bringing a rez sig, at the very least.

I do disagree. DPS on a Warrior can work rather well too.

Snow Bunny · Jul 11, 2008, 04:14 PM // 16:14

It took me like 8 months to learn all that you learned in 10 matches

Just...

Keep doing what you're doing, you're fine. As you gain more experience you'll learn to evaluate skills and to experiment a bit more with secondary professions to use them to your advantage.

But excellent work so far, you'll be seriously PvPing in no time by the sounds of it.

LifesRestorer · Jul 11, 2008, 04:31 PM // 16:31

you have given me new found hope in new players. i love you.

Tearz1993 · Jul 11, 2008, 04:42 PM // 16:42

Nice work!

Looks like you show a lot of promise!

If you need any help, pm me IGN Tearz Of Purity

kvndoom · Jul 11, 2008, 04:51 PM // 16:51

That's very impressive. I've been playing this game for 3 years and still can't monk worth a crap. Smite or heal maybe, but I suck so bad at prot. You'll go places.

The guy who flamed you was probably some dumb wammo (warrior / monk, be prepared to see a LOT of them in RA and most can't play for shit) who was already jealous because he wouldn't get primary healing duties.

Get used to trash talk. It generally comes from two types of players: people who royally suck at the game but compensate by insulting better players; or people whose heads got big because they are good at RA (random arenas does NOT make them pro). Truly good players will see your potential and give constructive criticism (sometimes more harsh than need be, but you'll know they mean well). That's the feedback to look out for.

Good luck with Guild Wars!

Destiny2097 · Jul 11, 2008, 05:07 PM // 17:07

RA is ok to start out with because u will face a large variety of builds, but u won't learn much about positioning, spikes etc. although that can be saved for another time. Sometimes there are decent players in RA, but most of the time u will be happy with at least 1 in your team when monking that can do some decent damage or shutdown.

Personally i prefer using woh or sometimes hc in RA, because there can be tons of damage in RA which zb can't always keep up with. It is also bad against signet of humility which a lot of mesmers bring atm(maybe slightly less now with recent nerfs), or if zb is interrupted/disabled by other means u will feel some big pressure fairly quickly (unless u take something like gift of health but still, it can't be used on yourself).

Here are a list of some things which u will may encounter in RA and some ways to deal with them if ur team can't:

- e-denial (weapon swap)
- interrupts (fast cast/block skills/hide behind objects vs ranger)
- kd lock (pre-prots/block skills/defensive set)
- hexes e.g. migrane (pre-veil/ 1/4 cast skills like patient spirit/signets)
- daze (pre-prot if possible e.g. guardian vs bha/fast cast/block skills/ 1/4 cast skills/kiting to let it run its duration)
- who to save and who to let die (eventually u will find yourself in situations where u can only save one person when 2 or more are about to die, so who to save? if u have been watching the game closely then u should have an idea of who has a res sig left, they are higher priority than someone with no res. or if the team has no res left, then who can still win the match for u?)

There are some guides here for monking and playing in general, and there are plenty more that can be easily searched for.

pm me if u have anymore questions

Legendary Shiz · Jul 11, 2008, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarlett W

Thanks for the quick replies guys. As I said, I got extremely lucky with my team, as the Dervish guy was a killing machine. Noticed that those who were brave and just stood there died really quickly, I am more of a coward and just ran from the warriors and assassins chasing me. Guess being a live coward is better than a dead brave person.

I guess I'll unlock gift of health and holy veil and give those a try. Already have shield of absorption, but that seemed a little redundant with shielding hands. Only chose shielding hands based on the casting time, though I wish I had shield of absorption during those times when my guardian got interrupted and I had two warriors stuck to my butt.

I hadn't even considered a spear, but I guess I'll give that a shot too.

He said Brave. This is a quality newbie.

The major upside of Veil is that you can pre-veil yourself before you go into a match. This is nice in RA/TA because you usually load up around 15-20 seconds before the match starts, giving you time to not only put it on yourself, but to recoup the energy and let the skill cool down. This already puts you a step ahead of your competitors.

PS start ABing, and don't fall in with the Suxons. Be a Brave Kurzick and we'll play together sometime.